Comments on: Tunnel Takes City Council Step Forward, Referendum Step Back

By: dw

dw — Wed, 02 Mar 2011 04:00:00 +0000

Yeah, well, the problem is you can cancel the tunnel and 520 and the state would still be broke.

I'm tired of voting for all of this. Didn't we vote for a tunnel a few years ago? Remember the FOUR rounds of votes on the monorail in, what, 4 years? Hell, even if the people of this city vote for the tunnel, someone will run another initiative out again the next year.

I'd rather see an initiative saying that if nothing is done and the viaduct does collapse, there will be a fund established to pay compensation to the victims, and it will be funded first by the seizing of all assets of all Seattle politicians elected since 1989. And if that's not enough to pay the compensation, then there's a 10% surcharge thrown on all property taxes in the city until all claims are satisfied.

The Culture Of Consensus is going to kill people on the viaduct. Let's get on with doing something.

By: Michael van Baker

Michael van Baker — Tue, 01 Mar 2011 23:31:00 +0000

bilco, I have to–respectfully–disagree that anyone’s “lost” on the tunnel and 520 until I see final EISes and the money to actually build either. Right now, there’s a political groupthink in evidence that makes weighing in more or less a charade. Would a public vote in either case change anything? I am not sure about that, but as I say, strictly in terms of past process, it’s not unusual. From my perspective, proceeding for the sake of “progress”–when we have yet to face up to how these projects in tandem break the state’s bank–merely postpones a reckoning with reality. But I am distinctly bearish on gas and property tax revenue for the foreseeable future.

By: bilco

bilco — Tue, 01 Mar 2011 21:34:00 +0000

Look, Mvb - I'm very displeased with how 520 is being handled. I believe speaking out about it, various citizen forums, citizen proposals are all fair game.

But, the time comes to say 'you win'. The new 520 is going to be rough on my Montlake community, but I don't think the whole city (or state!) should vote on it. Informed constituencies have weighed in, the state DOT and UW has bullied themselves around, and we lost. Game over.

We still should be active in tweaking whatever aspects are tweakable - that's responsible citizenship. There's a real safety issue at stake on 520 - I would argue not as severe as the viaduct, but that's me. We need to make progress, not continually study and re-study our oh-so-fascinating navels.

And that's what elected officials are charged with doing. Vote the bums out when they deserve it - and they mostly do.

By: Michael van Baker

Michael van Baker — Tue, 01 Mar 2011 06:49:00 +0000

Ha! ;) I didn’t think that was your plan with 520, bilco. I gotta say, we vote on all sorts of levies that represent a few hundred million dollars. A few billion seems worth the time, even if all that we determine is a majority doesn’t want to spend a few billion dollars on a tunnel.

By: bilco

bilco — Tue, 01 Mar 2011 02:48:00 +0000

Does anyone support the idea of a republic anymore? Citizens shouldn't have to vote on every issue. That's why we actually pay these people to run the government.

What harm in a vote? Well, it costs money, muddies the water and tends to be inconclusive (see that last idiotic 'advisory' ballot)

Let the government govern. If you don't like 'em, vote agin 'em. End of story.

By: RVO

RVO — Tue, 01 Mar 2011 01:11:00 +0000

We seem to be in an age of anti-democracy in this city. What possible harm is there in having a vote? Well I can only think of one: we already had a vote and clearly, as a population, we said that we don't want this tunnel.

In all the years this has gone on, I've waited to hear anyone, anyone, tell me one, just one, good thing this tunnel does for the city that any other, cheaper option does not.

The city council has assured us that there won't be cost overruns. Uh huh. It's a tunnel through water-soaked 100-year old fill dirt. No way that's going to be a problem.

The city council didn't hear you fellow citizens. Sign the petition that calls for a vote. Vote these lunkheads out. Return sanity to our fair city.