Comments on: The Sounders Are a Mac, The Mariners Are a PC

By: bigyaz

bigyaz — Tue, 24 Apr 2012 20:05:36 +0000

Yes, LA is a huge market, but it has two baseball teams, one of them one of the best teams in the league. The Dodgers have been down for years and in financial turmoil yet still draw large crowds. Totally destroys this articles premise.

Trying to compare a franchise like the Mariners with historic franchises like the Cubs, Yankees and Red Sox — and trying somehow to tie it to the location of the ballpark — is a long stretch. Only a very few teams continue to draw big crowds when they suck, particularly for almost a decade as the Mariners have.

Baltimore and Pittsburgh have beautiful stadiums in the heart of the city, surrounded by shops and restaurants. But the teams have been so bad for so long that a lively atmosphere can’t compensate.

I’ll be very curious to see the attendance figures if the Sounders finish in last place for seven or eight years in a row.

By: Tamara Vallejos

Tamara Vallejos — Wed, 18 Apr 2012 22:29:01 +0000

I agree it’s apples and oranges, and I can toss in a bunch more variables in response to your reply that would only further illustrate that, but my intention really wasn’t to argue that the Seattle sports should look to L.A. for tips on facilities (obviously they are very different cities with extremely different considerations). My only qualm was that I felt the inclusion of the Dodgers as a struggling team, attendance-wise, was a little out of left field (pun not intended?)–and generally inaccurate, even when taking into account the size of the stadium and the market.

On a positive note, more relevant to Seth’s article, I love the point he brought up about the Sounders making an effort to reach out to the “cool kids,” knowing the families will come along with that at some point. I give mad props to an organization that actively seeks to target what I’m assuming refers to a 20- and 30-something crowd, and I can think of a few other local organizations I wish cared as much…. I especially look forward to seeing how the Sounders’ strategy holds up over a more significant amount of time.

By: sammysounder74

sammysounder74 — Wed, 18 Apr 2012 21:59:39 +0000

Yes, because both ESPN and KeyArena are worthless. . . .

The point is that the Mariners (and Baseball as a whole) are making stupid marketing decisions that’s shrinking the size of their fanbase. I have a huge family in Eastern Washington and everyone over 40 wants to see the Mariners when they come to Seattle. The younger generation wants to see Sounders.

By: Michael van Baker

Michael van Baker — Wed, 18 Apr 2012 21:41:31 +0000

That argument seems a little apples-and-oranges, Tamara, though I am not a sportsball expert. “Struggle” is a relative term: LA is a huge market, so the fact that they are near the top in absolute attendance is not reflective of a competitive edge. Dodgers Stadium holds some 56K people, so at 46K during their good years, they are still far from sold out. Last year’s 36K is 64% of capacity. When the Ms are popular, they can average 43K (48K capacity), even though LA has six times the population base. I’m not sure any of this helps or hinders Seth’s argument–if any city was disposed to make parking lot-ringed stadiums work, it’s LA.

By: CG

CG — Wed, 18 Apr 2012 21:19:10 +0000

Yeah because when I want to doublecheck facts I always rush right to ESPN!!!!!!!!! Great idea! Unless I’m checking facts about how much money talking about the Red Sox and the Yankees around-the-clock brings in ESPN is as worthless as Key Arena

By: Tamara Vallejos

Tamara Vallejos — Wed, 18 Apr 2012 17:20:29 +0000

Wait, you completely lost me when you said teams like the Dodgers struggle to attract fans. I’m genuinely confused by that statement; the team is consistently in the top 5 when it comes to attendance rankings, while the Royals are consistently in the bottom 5. If you’d like to actually check attendance statistics (at least for the past decade), visit: http://espn.go.com/mlb/attendance

Since 2001, the Dodgers have been ranked 1st, 2nd, or 3rd in MLB attendance 7 of those years. The other years? 8th place in 2001, 5th place in 2002, 4th in 2003, and…11th in 2011. In fact, 2011 was the first time the Dodgers REALLY struggled with attendance in years, failing to hit the 3-million mark, and that was only because a massive boycott against Frank McCourt and the way he was running the team.

I don’t predict the numbers in 2012 to immediately bounce back, new ownership or not. But even so, you certainly can’t throw around the statement that “Teams in stadiums ringed by parking lots–the Dodgers, Royals, the White Sox–are the teams that struggle to attract fans, even in good times.” It’s patently false, at least as far as the Dodgers are concerned. While I personally don’t know how I feel about this SoDo situation, the Dodgers having a stadium nestled in a Los Angeles ravine, far from the bustle of urban amenities, doesn’t seem to have harmed the team.